IS ROBERT REALLY A LUTHERAN?

 This is interesting - well, in so far as Christian nonsense can be interesting.

This guy quickly identifies the differences between the various Christian denominations. It's worth a quick view.

A take-out I got from it is that Robert is wearing the wrong hat. He should have a Lutheran one on as, according to the definition of Lutheranism in the above it more closely matches what Robert expounds than does Catholicism.

"The flaps keep my ears warm when I stupidly dunk myself in freezing water."

SAME OLD

 The New Zealand Catholic Church is in the news again facing a complaint that it is denying natural justice to survivors by keeping some of its redress process secret.

The Church of course objects to this and claims that it has a transparency policy and points to the New Zealand Catholic Bishop's Conference where just such issues were discussed.

It also advises that there is a process where complaints can be addressed:

Of course what it doesn't say is that when victims ask for some redress they aren't listened to, complaints are not upheld and everything is done in secret. See:

COMPLAINTS NOT UPHELD

I thought it best to talk to a representative of the Roman Catholic Church and who best but Robert ... no, not Robert ... Robert's new found best friend ... no, not Kellie-Jay Keen-Minshull aka Posie Parker ... Doctor Father Alfred, newly arrived in Lower Hutt and bringing with him a background in science and concert piano playing which he has put further back in the background in order to promulgate the church's fairy tales, raise money from the congregation, sell indulgences, indulge in archaic and arcane rituals and to be a spiritual mentor (another one) to Robert the apathetic sanctimonious sinner, toilet cleaner, and threatener of eternal damnation.

I met with the doc outside the church shop in Jackson street.

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: What's up doc?

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: Heaven. Heaven's u .... oh, I see. Ha ha - I used to love Bugs Bunny but that was before I became a priest and left behind fairy tales, fables and funny stories ....

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Yeah right. And you say that with a straight face.

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: I believe in it. I was a St Pat's boy (Silverstream) and was in the 'P' classes ...

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: And now you're a doctor. Hey, can you look at this on my back? Is it a melanoma ?

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: I'm not that sort of doctor. I have a PhD in environmental science. It's Robert the ... whatever ... who insists in calling me Doctor Father Alfred. I think he's a bit of a sycophant.

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: I think you mean psychopath but then, you gave all that science and music up didn't you?

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: Yes, like the Samaritan woman, I was confused, and the purpose and meaning of life seemed beyond me. I had dreams of being a great scientist or a famous concert pianist, but these paths did not seem to lead to fulfilment. It wasn’t until I met Jesus that I finally understood that, after all, I’m not any one of these parcels...

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Jeez ... now I'm confused ...


DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: Like the Samaritan woman?

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: No, like a normal person. Why would you give up a glittering career and a fantastic musical vocation to peddle this Eucharist, Ascension, Assumption, saints, martyrs and sacraments rubbish?

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: I don’t necessarily need to be that great musician or that great concert pianist or that great scientist who makes the discoveries. Jesus had it covered. I could find a purpose in being able to share the love that I received, and to be able to go out there and say to people that God exists in their life, too.

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Yeah - got it - burnt out eh? Either that or you're like me, a procrastinator looking for a sinecure.

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: Well ..

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Look, let's move on before Robert tries to put his oar in. I just can't face having to type out that damn long and silly title he's given himself every-time he says something.

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: OK, that I can understand.

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Why is the Catholic Church suppressing details of complaints against it?

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: The National Office for Professional Standards appoints independent external professionals to inquire into complaints of abuse. The Complaints Assessment Committee reviews the evidence gathered in that process. The final decision on whether to uphold a complaint is made by the relevant Church authority, either a bishop or a congregational leader. Many complaints are upheld ...

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: ... Hold up there Sparky. I read that press release from Virginia Noonan the Church director for the National Office for Professional Standards too. That's just the company line you're quoting there.

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: Ha ha - OK, rumbled.

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: But do you believe it?

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: You come to know Jesus after a period of time. And once you encounter him, nothing in your life other than following him and committing yourself to priesthood makes any sense at all.

Whatever you do you should live in such a way that the people you meet will also ask who Jesus is and you help them to be curious and fascinated by him. You look for ways to give them the life-giving water that is God’s gift to them, Jesus.

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Jesus!

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: Yes, Jesus.

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Sheesh! That's just the Catholic propaganda brief you're reciting. Look Doc, I don't think that you can help me here - you've been brainwashed.

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: Wellington Cardinal John Dew advised me to “be creative and imaginative in the ways that we preach the Gospel and make Jesus known” to an unenthusiastic society. I'm just following him on that.

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Yeah, well good luck with that.

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: Thanks my son.

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: I'm not your son ... hey! I just had a thought. You went to Saint Patrick's Silverstream didn't you?

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: Yes, why?

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Did you know Father Woodcock there?

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: Ummm...

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Father Minto?

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: Ummm...

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Father Durning?

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: Err .... look I don't know what you're inferring ...

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: OK. We have to wrap it up now anyway there are some cops here and want us to move along.

DOCTOR FATHER ALFRED: I'd better go ... I've got some confessions to listen to.

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Say hi to Robert for me.

RELIGION, HUH, WHAT IS IT GOOD FOR?

 This post is a 'biggie'. It is long I'm afraid due to the important and complex issues covered. It is also an 'act of faith' because I know that 50% of the readers won't read it and the other 50% of readers cannot read it because it is long. I do it because I believe that a summary of the major religions is necessary on a blog that has religion as its theme.

As you can see, I've taken screenshots from the internet to highlight the essential differences between the main religions. I'm sure that you will appreciate the effort that has gone into doing this for you. I was going to expand these into arguments for each religion as to why it is more important or superior to other religions or, religiocentrism (see the definition above) but decided to invite in a representative of each of the main religions to put their argument to you directly.

We have with us:

Bin Hire* - Islam Overview.      * Courtesy of Richard's Bass Bag.

Boobisha Chodhanky - Hinduism Overview.

A-wat Suppdok -  Buddhism Overview

Mannis Funifeller - Judaism Overview

Robert* - Christianity Overview.     * Courtesy of Robert the apathetic sanctimonious sinner, toilet cleaner, and threatener of eternal damnation.

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON (Moderator): Welcome everyone to this little but extremely important forum where each of you will be able to provide a snapshot of your favourite religion ... ha ha ... a little joke there (ahem) ...

BIN HIRE: Hello and thank you for inviting me and a big shout out to my benefactor Richard of Richard's Bass Bag - (the original bass bagging site) who gave me permission to ...

BOOBISHA CHODHANKEY: (under his breath) Brahman, what a toady, I hope he gets reincarnated as a frog ... Hello all and thank you and my gods for allowing this.

A-WAT SUPPDOK: Greetings and peace and love be with you without nasty alcohol. I feel somehow that I've been here before ...

MANNIS FUNIKFELLER: Thanks to the one true god I am here with you all and look forward to telling you of what is true.

ROBERT: Hello all I'm pleased to be here but can I ask that we move things on a bit as I have to pray at 3 O'clock and dunk myself in the pool ...

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Thanks everyone and Robert - be nice please and can you stop making that clicking noise with those rosary beads? Right. Let's start in the order that you've acknowledged yourself. A very brief summary of your religion please. Bin Hire?

BIN HIRE: The Islamic faith is monotheistic, believing in Allah as the one true God. The Islamic faith teaches that the prophet Muhammad is Allah’s final messenger, who continued to receive messages from Allah to share with the people. The Quaran is the holy book of Islam.

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Thanks Bin, that was very 'text book'. Robert will be jealous. Boobisha you're up.

BOOBISHA CHODHANKEY: As with all religions, there are multiple sects of Hinduism, each with some variations in their practices. Core beliefs of Hinduism  teaches that God’s presence exists in all of creation. In the Hindu faith, god goes by many names and manifests in infinite ways. Brahman is the recognised supreme deity responsible for creating everything in the universe. Brahaman has no gender and is all-knowing and all-present. Shiva and Vishnu are the other primary Hindu deities (gods).There are many other deities (called devis), demi-gods (called devas) and goddesses, with significant variations among specific sects. The divine essence (called atman) dwells within each person.Hindus believe in reincarnation, with a constant cycle of being born, living and dying on the path to enlightenment.

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: (Jeez I thought I said keep it short) ...Thanks Boobisha. That'll set the cat among the pigeons. A-Wat, it's your turn.

A-WAT SUPPDOK: Buddhism was founded in the fifth century B.C. by Siddhartha Gautama, who later became known as the Buddha. After giving up an extravagant life of excess, the man who came to be known as the Buddha discovered enlightenment through giving up his wealth and position to live a simple life as a monk. His efforts to teach others how to do the same became the foundation of Buddhism. The Buddha is not worshiped as a god. He was a man and is recognised by Buddhists as such. Consistent with philosophy’s principles and truths, Buddhists follow a path of moral living, thinking and behaviour, as well as seeking wisdom.

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Thanks A-Wat. I guess you won't be staying for the after match piss-up then? Hey Manis - your turn.

MANNIS FUNIKFELLER: The Ten Commandments play an important role in the teachings of Judaism. Even beyond God’s law outlined in the Ten Commandments, righteousness and justice are central to the teachings of Judaism. The Hebrew Bible, which is also referred to as the Tanakh, is the primary holy text of the Jewish faith. It includes the same books as the Old Testament of the Christian bible, though they are in a different order. The first five books of the Hebrew bible form the Torah.

The Talmud is another holy text in Judaism. It includes an extensive collection of Jewish laws and various teachings specific to the faith.

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: (hee hee - that'll get the christians going). Robert, your turn.

ROBERT: Thanks The Religious Curmudgeon. Look - all those guys are wrong, OK? Christianity is the largest religion in the world and there is only one true god - God. The Roman Catholic Church is the only true religion within Christianity and all of the others are just as silly as these other religions. Christians believe in the Holy Trinity, represented by the divinity of the Father (God), son (Jesus) and the Holy Spirit. Christian teachings are grounded in the Old Testament and the New Testament that together form the Holy Bible. There are several editions of the Christian bible; not all denominations use the same version.

Christians believe that Jesus Christ is the son of God, sent to earth as a man and a messiah to save people from their sins. Catholics - the best and true christians believe that Jesus (GOD) is actually in the communion host that we eat at Mass. I believe this and look forward to God entering me every week. I go to Mass with my guardian angel who ascends to join the thousands of other angels watching as Jesus manifests Himself in the sacred waver (sic) and wine, which we consume, and then receive grace and unimaginable comforting. 

Guardian angels are appointed to everyone at conception. They are pure spirit and intellect. But can present themselves in bodily form if God allows.
They are there for everyone regardless of the person's knowledge of facts.

My favourite of all though is Mary - she's still a virgin even after giving birth to God who actually impregnated her not Joseph her husband who was not an old man and who had no sexual inclination toward Mary! Rather St Joseph was not that old maybe 33 and had taken a vow of celibacy. So, both Joseph and Mary were virgins........

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON:  ....... Robert. Robert. ROBERT! ...... We'll leave it there OK .... Umm ...thanks everyo .....

GENERAL MELEE: "Bullshit you sanctimonious twat you guys didn't invent the bible and" ....."Virgins? Brahman give me a break" ... "Allah is the only true God he ..." .... "We don't need gods - Buddha isn't a god he's a good man who ..." ... "Piss off Noddy, don't tell me there are no gods. There are plenty and we've got most of them I'll get Vishnu to ..." ..."Prick!"..."Bastard, take this ..." ...."Hey arsehole..."

THE RELIGIOUS CURMUDGEON: Guys. Guys. GUYS! Stop it. We'd better call it quits and the after match function is cancelled you bloody fools. Jeez! I think next time it's be safer having a forum on local gangs and their differences. Piss off now.

*****************

Forum called off early which gave Robert a chance to pray with his broken rosary beads and to take a plunge in the cold pool. We don't know what he's having for dinner.

The others (except A-Wat) sloped off to the pub seeing that someone had lifted Robert's wallet during the scuffle.

" ... FOR BETTER OR FOR WORSE ..."

 I read today that Pope Frank is looking to change the rules and the Catholic Church will in the near future allow priests to marry.

I hope that this does happen as it's long overdue.

I like old Frank - he's dragging the silly Catholic Church, kicking and screaming into the real world and is addressing, not turning a blind eye to its many problems. It's unlikely though that this backward organisation would allow female priests or same sex marriages among priests but it's a start.

Let's look at a domestic scenario with a married priest and his wife:

PRIEST: Mary - have you seen my stole?

MRS PRIEST: It's in your socks drawer. Sheesh! Do I have to know where all of your silly stuff is?

PRIEST: It's not silly Mary. You know that it's important and I have to have ...

MRS PRIEST: Yeah, yeah. Your amice, alb, cincture, maniple, chasuble, dalmatic, surplice - boy, do I need to go on? Boys and their toys.

PRIEST: You know that I have to look good. That Father Devon Haier is always trying to show me up ...

MRS PRIEST: Father 'Debonair' - OK, why don't you marry him then?

PRIEST: Mmmmm  (blushing) ... you know that Il Papa wouldn't allow that - anyway, I'm married to you my sweet.

MRS PRIEST: Mmmm.

PRIEST: Look I've got to get going. It's an important Mass this morning with all the kids training for their First Communion ...

MRS PRIEST: Here we go again. It's bloody Sunday. Don't you ever get a day off? I wanted to go to the beach to show off my new swimming costume.

PRIEST: Mary, you knew when you married me that I'd have to work on Sundays and besides - do you think it appropriate for a priest's wife to be wearing those skimpy thong things?

MRS PRIEST: At least it gets me noticed. Umm - do you have to go so early? Why don't you come back to bed for a wee lie-in?

PRIEST: No, I've got to go. Jesus is waiting.

MRS PRIEST: Well put the bloody rubbish bins out on the way!

PRIEST: Sheesh!

MRS PRIEST: And don't forget your silly stole.

PRESS BUTTONS*

 

Will Robert?

He's been flirting with Presbyterianism for sometime now and often regales with stories about how awfully austere their churches are compared to his beloved catholic churches:

This kind of suggests that Robert sees 'him' everywhere in his catholic church. I blame the cleaning chemicals he breathes.

There are more but I guess that you get the idea. Robert doesn't approve of Presbyterianism. He'd rather see his Christ all gory with fresh blood and gristle glistening in the candlelight. Yum! I guess it gives him an appetite for confession and satisfies his carnal desires.

So what is it about Presbyterianism that he doesn't like?

Christianity FCKU  FAQ has this to say:

OK, so they have the same origin, share similarities and both expound a myth about some fantastical being creating and controlling our lives. Why do they have to argue about something that's inherently nonsense?

Another Catholic source, badly written, probably by someone from the Philippines says:

"The difference between Presbyterian and Catholic is that Presbyterianism is a reformed tradition from Protestantism. In contrast, Catholicism is the Christian methodology, where Catholicism implies the Roman Catholic Church. Presbyterian believes that, a priority of Scriptures, faith in God. Sovereignty in God, where Catholics believe that Jesus Christ cure human sins and Jesus Christ is the son of God. Five hundred thousand people follow Presbyterianism. The other way out, 17.4 percent of people were following Catholicism. Presbyterians are Protestant while Catholics are not.

The Catholic Church can trace its lineage and history all the way back to the apostle Peter, who Catholics view as a kind of first pope. As such, the Catholic faith is viewed as the oldest and most “traditional” form of Christianity. Protestantism is a type of reformed Christianity that focuses less on church structure and more on the Bible alone. Both Protestants and Catholics believe in the Holy Trinity, the rebirth of Jesus, and the divinity of the Bible.
A Protestant is simply anyone who follows a Christian faith that broke away from the Catholic Church during the aptly named Protestant Reformation. Other Protestant faiths include the Lutheran, Baptist, and Evangelical traditions."

As well as being difficult to read it's arrogant but this goes with catholic hubris.

"Why Presbyterianism?" you might ask. Well, this morning on my walk the little Presbyterian church at the end of our road looked really nice in the sunlight.

It makes you want to rush in and pray to Jesus ...

... not really.

* What we used to call Presbyterians when I was at school.